'The Homecoming'

[Kambei]

Is it strictly kids TV? It's a lot more violent than the usual Saturday morning kids fare. It also ssems that it is geared towards the fans of the older series who are now thirty and forty-somethings. We actually see people getting killed. A far cry from the days of shows like Battlestar Galactica. The network told the producers of that show that they were not allowed to show any human getting killed on screen. I know it happened, but very rarely. The best description I ever read of Scarlet was: 'Puppets done by Tarantino'
I think the whole point of picking through the episodes is to create a background to the new series, and especially Scarlet's retrometabolism abilities so that people can write fan fiction about the new series that reflects the extremely high standard of the works that I have already read on this site.

[chrisbishop]

I would think, Marion, that all your questions could be answered with one easy explanation - it's just easier not to have to worry about that stuff. After all, it's only kids TV.

Great sets and some good animation (the fencing was fab). Even Capt Scarlet's face seems to have a bit more of that original 'steely' look but gaping plot holes and a weak script still leave me a bit cold.

Sorry not to agree with you - but 'gaping plot holes and a weak script' can make a difference about a show being good or not - and can make a viewer decide if he'll come back again or if he'll think the writers are plainly thinking him stupid - and NOT come back. That means it could have an influence on the show's future! Special effects are not ALL that makes a story. A good story telling is equally - if not MORE, in my opinion - important.

[Kambei]

I totally agree with you Chris. Effects should add to a storyline, not replace it. I also agree with Marion that Lewis's attack on Scarlet did not make a lot of sense, unless a known side effect of suspended animation is personality disorder or paranoia, and if that was the case, surely he would have been under close medical supervision until the symptoms wore off. Maybe Scarlet put the attack down to that and that is why he went to see Doctor Gold.
I think the best recent case in point of effects vs plot is Independence Day . Absolutely superb special effects and plot holes so big you could drive a Death Star through with room to spare. But then it was a feelgood movie.
On another point, what Marion was saying earlier about certain things not carrying over from the original, I notice that Scarlet does not feel nauseous in the presence of Mysterons.

[Marion]

I am broadly in agreement with most of what's been said. I think.
CGI Scarlet is splendid to look at - on the whole. The action is fast and furious - but in some cases, it is so fast and furious that it leaves gaping holes in the plot. I, personally, do not find swanky new machines and technology enough of a compensation for lazy story-telling. Nor does it does excuse the clunky dialogue or the mediocre acting of the voice artists (who really do not seem enthused by their roles.)
The background to the characters is important to any series, I would have thought, especially if you want your audience to empathise with the hero or heroine of their choice.
I can't help thinking that when the original series was done - and many other Anderson shows - the accompanying merchandising - especially the books and comics - were very adroitly used; they filled in the backgrounds and gave depths to the on-screen characters that a 30 minute show simply did not have time to do.
With CGI Scarlet - we have none of that background resource to draw on. Even the offical website is still largely in-operative and what information there is is patchy.
Kambei says:
I think the whole point of picking through the episodes is to create a background to the new series, and especially Scarlet's retrometabolism abilities so that people can write fan fiction about the new series that reflects the extremely high standard of the works that I have already read on this site.

And that may be right - but I doubt if I, for one, will be writing about the new characters in a hurry. There simply isn't enough to go on yet.
I understand we have to give the new series time to bed down and for the shock of the new to wear off - but I'm afraid that as it becomes a more familiar entity, the weaknesses of storyline and dialogue might become more apparant....?
Maybe the kids won't care? Maybe their attention spans have shrunk to the sound-bite and the 3 minute clip? CGI Scarlet is up against much tougher competition than the original was - and consequently its going to have to work hard to be different and get itself noticed. The puppet shows were - technically - some of the best of their kind there's ever been (and some of their plots weren't up to much!) - I doubt you could say that of the CGI version... (I haven't seen many other CGI programmes so cannot really judge that side of it).
I shall watch all the episodes, even so, but like Captain Wil - it still leaves me a bit cold - which is a crying shame.

[captain wil]

Sorry not to agree with you - but 'gaping plot holes and a weak script' can make a difference about a show being good or not - and can make a viewer decide if he'll come back again or if he'll think the writers are plainly thinking him stupid - and NOT come back. That means it could have an influence on the show's future! Special effects are not ALL that makes a story. A good story telling is equally - if not MORE, in my opinion - important.

I actually think we are agreeing. The last thing I want is to put down the new CS out of hand. I do think the technical aspects of the show are outstanding (bar the usual niggles with CGI faces) and I'll happily shout their praises but, so far, I feel the actual storytelling/voice acting ect. is woefully sub-par. I was merely saying that while we here may debate the minature of plot points and characterisation I imagine the real reason there are inconsistencies and the like is because it's only a kids show (despite what 30-40 somethings may like to believe) and they're likely not to notice (or really care).
Of course, not knowing the writers I could be completely wrong

There, I think I've wittered on enough about this.

Wil

[Scarlet Lady]

I'm not going to go on about 'plot holes' much longer, but I just wanted to point out that we don't know how much has been left out of the episodes - MOM cuts them here and there, remember.

[Bozza]

Hi everyone,

In the case of plot issues and the question of why did Lewis attack Scarlet in the gym, the first thing you have to ask yourself is do Mysterons make mistakes? Lewis is in part a much more inferior Mysteron than Scarlet, he misses the important element of being indestructible and this drove him to attack Scarlet in the gym. He had no chance of killing him there, but he wanted to make a point. (hehe..get it?)
Bozza

[Marion]

I wonder if the attack by Lewis on Scarlet was part of a personal 'war of nerves' the Mysterons are carrying on against Scarlet?
We have lost the Mysterons warning the Earth that they will conduct a 'war of nerves' against everyone and we no longer get the threats every week; instead we get Scarlet hearing voices. These are usually fairly threatening and they harp on about how 'we' (presumably the Mysterons') 'made you' and how they will destroy him again.
It seems to me that the Mysterons did not 'make' Scarlet. They Mysteronised him - possibly on Mars, but concievably on Skybase - and then he did their bidding - until Blue shot him and he fell through the plasma beam...
Perhaps - as with the fall from the Car-Vu - that freed him from their influence and the Mysterons don't know why it happened - anymore than the humans do.
They might be testing Scarlet to see if they could recover or destroy him?

[ROBE]

Well I presume Scarlet and Black were the first humans ever mysteronised

Maybe when they remade Scarlet they made the copy too good, so when he died again, the real Scarlet became dominant again.

They have not made the same mistake again with anyone they have killed.

[Marion]

So, are we not supposed to believe that it was the real Commander Lewis re-asserting himself in the replicant's body when he asked his daughter to 'kill this thing inside me' ? after he had fallen through some sort of blue-beamy-thing in the experimental reactor?
It might be that the Mysterons do make mistakes - or that they are not as capable of controlling the retrometabolised humans as they expected?
The hints given about 'Achilles Messenger' are speaking about a 'good Mysteron' - we've never had one of them before

[shaqui]

The hints given about 'Achilles Messenger' are speaking about a 'good Mysteron' - we've never had one of them before

Yes - the idea of a 'renegade Mysteron' - apart from Scarlet - is certainly interesting, and shows the new series is trying to move on to more forward on ideas than the somewhat formulaic original (ooh. here come the flames now... )

[Marion]

Yes, it was formulaic - I'll let you into a secret: it was for children and such programmes often are - however within the formula it could be very good - and quite appallingly awful.
The nice thing about it was that Scarlet was UNIQUE - he was a rehabilitated Mysteron agent - the only one ever to manage to get free. That made him special. If they can be 10 a penny, he's somehow lost that uniqueness... but I will fascinated to see how they do it.

[shaqui]

Yes, it was formulaic - I'll let you into a secret: it was for children and such programmes often are - however within the formula it could be very good - and quite appallingly awful.

Well I would argue against that and say on its native ATV, back in the sixties, some of the Anderson shows were given prime-time slots and promoted as family shows. Certainly they had a budget way beyond any regular children's programming of the time. 'Captain Scarlet' - both interestingly and annoyingly - was given a more conventional afternoon time slot...

[CAClark]

On another point, what Marion was saying earlier about certain things not carrying over from the original, I notice that Scarlet does not feel nauseous in the presence of Mysterons.

Circles of Doom should just have answered that to some degree

Cheers!

[shaqui]

Heeeey, welcome aboard Craig!

I bet you had some fun doing that episode! The air stunts were fantastic!