The Scarlet Thunderbird?

by **Parker Gabriel** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 8:01 pm

Is it featible for a crossover story of CAPTAIN SCARLET and "The Thunderbirds Of International Rescue," one in which Captain Scarlet actually joins International Rescue and becomes a Thunderbird himself, now that almost all the original members of the International Rescue Team are presumably dead?

What does everyone else in this forum think? Yea, nay, or don't know?

by **Gun-wielding Lombax** » Sat Oct 27, 2007 8:19 pm

Why would the Tracy boys be dead? I thought the series took place within a few years of each other. In fact many of the Supermarionation series (Fireball XL5, Stingray, Thunderbirds, Captain Scarlet) supposedly took place in the same timeframe, although the details don't always match: If the Fireball can travel faster than light, why can't Thunderbird 3 and Zero X? Not to mention the differently proportioned characters.

Anyway, my own answer would be no. Crossovers are best left to fan fiction and I think the fact that the television series never directly reference each other is a good thing, as it let them establish their own identity. I can't really see a reason why Scarlet would leave Spectrum for IR. Or even how he could, is Spectrum any wiser than the general public about who IR actually are?

by **hazel** » Sat Oct 27, 2007 9:32 pm

Scarlet couldn't become a Thunderbird anyway, as the Thunderbirds are the vehicles, not the people.

by **chrisbishop** » Sat Oct 27, 2007 9:42 pm

I don't know if it'll be believable for him to be a pilot of a Thunderbird. He's not really a pilot by profession, he's a soldier. Piloting craft in Spectrum is part of his job, because of Cloudbase's location, on one point, and because it's their main means of transport, on another point. Scarlet's work is more in the field - and considering his unique capacities, he might be wasted within International Rescue.

That said, if anyone presents a Thunderbirds/Captain Scarlet crossover, I'd still be really interested to read it and see how it goes!

Website · by **Sage** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 12:24 am

Well he was in the world army air force, so must have served as a pilot to an extent and been skilled to get so far (as opposed to regular army).

As it is I've been giving thought to a CS & TB crossover (a mysteron threat to IR, haven't settled on which timeline to use), but not got around to writing it yet.

by **James. C** » Mon Oct 29, 2007 7:06 am

I don't usually read fan fiction (time issues) but I'd love to read that!

by **Doc Denim** » Sun Nov 11, 2007 10:30 pm

Greetings all!

Long time since I've had time to participate!

I happen to like the whole idea of a CS/TB's cross-over, and in fact have had one in the works for ages - an excerpt has previous appeared here on the forum (It just took me half an hour to find it again!) and here's the page:

http://www.spectrum-headquarters.com/v- ... c&start=15

I am afraid to report that it isn't finished, though there are scads more of this tale written, just not in decent chronological order, so it is rather difficult to share much more at this point.

I did admit at the time this was posted that the whole 'time line' of TB's and CS is skewed in this bit of scribbling - and it assumes that Spectrum and TB's are contemporaries - I always assumed the Zero-X missions linked them in the same time frame - so no, it's not canon, but it is only fan-fic, so I'm not the least bit bothered by that. (And hope that no one else is either.)

Enjoy!

Doc Denim

by **DartBrat701** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 1:26 am

Nada! I also agree that crossovers like that, are best left to the fanfics.

However, some rules are indeed meant to be broken! :wink:

IMHO, I think the best crossovers would be between Thunderbirds & Stingray, as they are very similar in concept to each other. Add to the fact, that Gordon Tracy served in the WASPs before International Rescue was formed.

A Stingray\Captain Scarlet crossover is also feasible as Captain Grey and Lt. Green also served in the WASPs. :wink:

by **Marion** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 9:33 am

Stingray/CS crossovers have already been done.
Check out these stories on the website:
Clya Brown's excellent 'The Concordian Legacy'
http://www.spectrum-headquarters.com/the_concordian_legacy.htm

Nigel Preece's story 'Shades of Grey' - which features a pre-Spectrum Bradley Holden - http://www.spectrum-headquarters.com/shades_of_grey.htm

and, to a lesser extent, my own 'Synchronicity'.
http://www.spectrum-headquarters.com/synchronicity_1.htm
(That's the link to part 1 of 6 - sorry about that. :roll:

)
If I have missed any out, I apologise - please add them to the list

by **MMK** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 11:59 am

Marion wrote:If I have missed any out, I apologise - please add them to the list

I don't think you have missed any out... I ought to know that :wink:

by **Silverback** » Fri Nov 16, 2007 8:26 pm

From my personal 'research' I've found that Thunderbirds (2026) predates Captain Scarlet (2068) by 42 years! The retconned Thunderbirds movie takes place in 2065. So 'theoretically' any fanfic should be dervied from post-Thunderbirds movie era.

Now I've got that 'guff' out the way I say do as you will! :-D

by **chrisbishop** » Sat Nov 17, 2007 1:24 am

Ah, no... you are mistaken here!

The 'dating' controversy regarding 'Thunderbirds' was started WAAAAAAAAYYYYY before the movie in question. In fact, you could say it was at the very beginning, that the series was to be set in 2026 (or hereabouts). The 2065 settings (nearly contemporary to Scarlet, probably came up with the TV 21 mag - which tried to bring all the series (or nearly all of them) together into the same universe - something that wasn't even originally planned by the Andersons to begin with!

So, in truth, regarding the dates, there are really two schools of thought: 2026, or 2065. Neither of those date is wrong, and when it comes to stories, it doesn't really matter what you chose, as long as the story is a good read. And if ever you write other stories set in the same 'universe', it might be a good idea to stick to whatever choice you made (or clearly states that you are not following the same plotline as any previous story...)

I personally used the 2026 setting - making Lady Penelope an old lady at the time of Captain Scarlet, and the mentor of Rhapsody Angel (they've known each other, according to Rhapsody's biography). But I do like other stories using the other settings as well.

by **Parker Gabriel** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 1:48 am

According to the Colonel: "The 'dating' controversy regarding Thunderbirds was started WAAAAAAAAYYYYY before the movie in question. In fact, you could say it was at the very beginning, that the series was to be set in 2026 (or hereabouts). The 2065 settings (nearly contemporary to Scarlet, probably came up with the TV 21 mag--which tried to bring all the series (or nearly all of them) together into the same universe--something that wasn't even originally planned by the Andersons to begin with!

"So, in truth, regarding the dates, there are really two schools of thought: 2026, or 2065. Neither of those dates is wrong, and when it comes to stories, it doesn't really matter what you choose, as long as the story is a good read. And if ever you write other stories set in the same 'universe', it might be a good idea to stick to whatever choice you made (or clearly states that you are not following the same plotline as any previous story...)

"I personally used the 2026 setting--making Lady Penelope an old lady at the time of Captain Scarlet, and the mentor of (the) Rhapsody Angel (they've known each other, according to Rhapsody's biography). But I do like other stories using the other settings as well."

Another factor in favor of using the middle-to-late 2020s for " Thunderbirds" and the late 2060s and early 2070s for Captain Scarlet: Sylvia Anderson, who provided the voice of Her Ladyship the Duchess Penelope "Penny" Creighton-Ward in "'Birds," is nearing her seventies, and as such, I believe that, if Captain Scarlet ever makes it to live-action as I've always hoped it will, since the super-marionation puppet of the milady was sculpted to resemble her as a young woman, having her act out Lady Creighton-Ward in live-action would then be particularly appropriate. Less fortunately, she and Gerry Anderson would effectively have to be extorted in some way into working together again in that case, since the failure of their marriage was so bitter.

by **Marion** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 8:35 am

Parker Gabriel said:

Her Ladyship the Duchess Penelope "Penny" Creighton-Ward

I am not sure what the 'Birds' referred to is - is it an adventure in a comic? I wasn't aware that Lady P crops up in any CS stories, although she does feature in some biographies of Rhapsody Angel.
However, I have also only seen a reference to Penny's ancestor ' the Duchess of Creighton-Ward' but never to Penny herself being a Duchess. If she was, the correct title would be 'Her Grace, the Duchess of Creighton-Ward'.
She is only ever referred to as 'Lady Penelope Creighton-Ward' - as far as I am aware - so she might well be the daughter of a Duke; but titles - even Dukedoms - are not necessarily inherited by daughters of Dukes. If the title is entailed it goes to the nearest male relative. Penny might well get the non-entailed land and money, if there is any - which it seems there is - but not the title Duchess - unless she married a Duke.

by **Parker Gabriel** » Mon Nov 19, 2007 8:53 am

If I was mistaken, I apologize.

I suppose it relates to the source of confusion for Captain Blue in Mary Rudy's "Mixed Doubles," where both Captain Scarlet and his father are invested as Knights Commanders--General Metcalfe in the Most Honourable Order of Saints Michael and George (in Ian Fleming's and John Gardner's novels about James Bond, Bond himself is only a COMPANION of that order) and Captain Scarlet in the Most Honourable Order of the Bath. Captain Blue says to Mrs. Metcalfe, "I thought knights were knights?" But then, I'm American, and not versed in such matters.

And "'Birds" is short for "Thunderbirds," as in "The Thunderbirds Of International Rescue," in the context in which I used it.