The Blue/Symphony Thing
Moderator: Spectrum Strike Force
The Blue/Symphony Thing
by DocBrown » Sat Jul 03, 2004 3:30 am
(Originally posted on MSN Forum 03/05/2004)
This is something I’ve been meaning to write out for ages - a summary of the events that take place during Symphony’s dream sequence in the episode “Attack on Cloudbase”. The reason I’ve done it is that having watched it quite recently (and having just freeze-framed my way through it to write these notes), I’m convinced that there’s a lot more to it than is superficially apparent, and that there’s a good piece of fan-fic to be found in there somewhere if anybody feels like tackling it.
As a preamble, it’s worth commenting that the initial scene of Symphony in her cockpit is itself quite an interesting one. She’s had an uneventful flight and is going home. ‘Have completed patrol – am returning to Cloudbase’, she announces over her radio. But what patrol? Do the Angels go gallivanting off over barren deserts on the off-chance that the Mysterons might pull some sort of stunt down below? Surely not – so what was she doing there in the first place? There must have been a reason for her presence – something that is supported by the next event, which is that her aircraft is “hit” by something (which is never identified), causing her to crash. We hear a strange sound immediately prior to Symphony’s aircraft being struck, suggesting that we’re witnessing an attack as opposed to merely a mechanical failure.
After the plane crashes, we see Symphony’s helmet, with its communicator still active, left lying on the ground – something that anybody who was still firing on all thrusters would never do, so we have to believe that Symphony is now in a state of extreme delirium. We see an Angel aircraft overfly her position, but the pilot fails to spot her. It’s not clear at this stage whether this is real or Symphony is hallucinating, but she’s clearly dejected and feeling abandoned. In her delirium, Symphony associates this aircraft with Destiny, who is ordered to return to Cloudbase when the Mysterons issue their threat to destroy it.
In the next scene, we see the inevitable slanging match between Captain Blue and Colonel White when the former realises that the aerial search for Symphony has been called off. During the course of this, White asks Blue whether he is in love with Symphony, and he admits that he is. The meaning of this is obvious – Symphony desperately needs to hear Blue admit his love for her, since he’s evidently never said as much. But women usually know when a man is in love with them, unless the man in question is exceptionally good at concealing his feelings for extended periods of time (e.g. Mr Darcy and Eliza Bennett), and Captain Blue has never come across as someone who can conceal his feelings. On the contrary he’s unusually demonstrative for a man, at least when the issue at stake is someone else’s well-being, so it would be my guess is that he’s not in love with Symphony at all, but reluctant to put her out if her misery by telling her so – assuming that he knows, of course. Men can be incredibly good at completely failing to perceive something that’s blatantly obvious to a woman.
Could he be gay? It’s tempting to consider the possibility, but I don’t think so: Symphony would surely have realised (though my sister once spent several months chasing one particularly unresponsive man before a friend took her to one side and quietly told her that she was wasting her time). No – I think he’s just not interested – which raises the question of why not, since genuinely available men (and a lot who aren’t) don’t tend to turn it down when it’s presented to them on a plate. If there was another woman - especially if that woman was another Angel - Symphony would certainly know about it (or at least have very strong suspicions), either from her own direct observation or from the behaviour of her colleagues. So there’s a mystery here, both to the viewers and almost certainly to Symphony herself, since we are now seeing the world through Symphony’s eyes.
The next element in the puzzle is revealed when a UFO appears on Magenta’s radar screen. Rhapsody is ordered to take off to investigate it, and is blown out of the sky. I think the implication is obvious – in trying to make sense of the situation, Symphony believes she’s identified Rhapsody as a rival for Blue’s affections, and therefore has her eliminated. In passing, I note that the buzzing noise heard in Rhapsody’s cockpit immediately prior to her death is the same one that we hear in Symphony’s cockpit prior to her crash. Could it be that Symphony resents the situation she finds herself in, identifies it with the circumstances of her crash-landing and wishes it upon the woman she now sees as her rival? Maybe. It’s interesting that Symphony uses the Mysterons as the means of killing Rhapsody – it’s almost as if she turns to her enemies in her hour of need, perhaps recognising that only they have the power to destroy the people, real or imagined, that now keep Blue from her. Her own loyalties prevent her from doing this, but by using the enemy she absolves herself from blame.
Why do the Mysterons appear in corporeal form in Symphony’s mind? Their physical presence clearly isn’t necessary for them to carry out their dirty work, and yet Symphony evidently needs them to be there. I wonder if in her delirium she recognises that she is dying, and desperately wants to see her destroyers – just once - before she dies. I’m not convinced by that explanation though.
Colonel White now addresses the troops, after which he tells Scarlet to get his hair cut. Blue asks Scarlet what the colonel wanted to say to him, and Scarlet tells him that the colonel is simply maintaining discipline, and that he’s a wonderful man. Blue takes issue with that sentiment because Symphony has been abandoned. So what’s this bit all about? Symphony is presumably recognising that Scarlet does get out of line sometimes – the incidents related in “White as Snow” are ample evidence of the fact. But is she seeing that facet of his personality as a positive or a negative thing? I think she’s seeing it as a negative thing, because Blue argues with him – and Blue is her man.
So in Symphony’s eyes, Scarlet has done something wrong. And that something is, in her delirious mind, sufficient to warrant sending him to his death – because that's what happens in the next scene, when Scarlet volunteers to attack single-handedly the flying saucers that are now approaching Cloudbase, overriding Colonel White’s initial reaction to send the remaining Angels into action. Symphony has evidently now decided that the remaining Angels are guiltless, and that Scarlet must die for his crime, whatever it might be. Destiny argues in vain with the Colonel on this point, suggesting perhaps that she is an unwilling accomplice to Scarlet’s perceived villainy in some sense.
The Colonel heaps praise upon Scarlet’s bravery, and Lieutenant Green mutters about it being easy to be brave when you’re indestructible – an obvious point that the Colonel plainly can’t see. Presumably Symphony is herself irritated at the amount of praise that Scarlet attracts, and wants to put an end to it – though whether that’s her only motivation for wanting Scarlet out of the way is debatable. Personally, I reckon there’s more to it – I think she’s reacting to what she sees as hypocrisy here, in which Scarlet uses his heroic stature to conceal a darker side.
Before Scarlet can be taken to Sick Bay, Doctor Fawn is killed. In Symphony’s mind, this is presumably to ensure that Scarlet cannot be resuscitated – she has drawn a lethal trap around him from which he cannot escape, again using her enemies to do it so that she cannot personally be blamed. The appearance in Sick Bay of Captain Black is the final nail in Scarlet’s coffin - in this scene, Black is Death, just as surely as if he were wearing a long dark hooded habit and carrying a scythe. Scarlet’s time has come, and he will not be returning ever again.
At this point, Lieutenant Green attempts to calm Colonel White down, just as White attempted to calm him down earlier when he started getting jittery over the Mysterons’ apparent inaction. I think Symphony is saying here that she sees Green as every bit the Colonel’s equal, and that the Colonel is belatedly recognising the fact. Captain Magenta by now has gone completely potty trying to count the flying saucers – something that comes over as a bit of a comic interlude. Perhaps Symphony’s simply expressing the view that in her eyes he’s simply a waste of space, but again I’m not entirely happy with that: the fact that Magenta appears in the story at all suggests to me that he’s in some way involved in whatever intrigue Symphony is trying to unravel in her mind.
By this time Cloudbase is on the point of crashing. Captain Blue gives a detailed and presumably accurate assessment of the situation to Colonel White, who evidently finally recognises Blue’s true worth – Symphony clearly feels that he has been undervalued in the past. Blue’s arm is broken in the attack, and Colonel White’s permission for him to take a jet pack and escape comes too late for him to take advantage of it. This is interesting – does Symphony want him to escape or not? Obviously she invents the broken arm to prevent him from doing so, and yet his words imply that had his arm not been broken, he would have tried to escape. Perhaps she wants to know how he feels when faced with certain death – will he be the noble man that she believes him to be right to the end?
By now the end is very near. The Colonel’s last message to Spectrum Headquarters in London includes the words that “Cloudbase is severely damaged and out of control”. I’m wondering if maybe there’s a double meaning here. Is Symphony perhaps saying that the moral fibre of the personnel on Cloudbase is severely damaged and out of control? Cloudbase then begins to fall out of the sky, with the Colonel going down with his command. It is not clear whether Captain Blue dies before the base is destroyed.
There are an awful lot of questions here, and I’m hoping that some of them will get tackled in any discussion that gets added to this thread. What sort of dark plots are being hatched in the recesses of Symphony’s delirium? And are they entirely the product of her deranged imagination – or is there more substance there than might appear on the surface?
DocBrown
This is something I’ve been meaning to write out for ages - a summary of the events that take place during Symphony’s dream sequence in the episode “Attack on Cloudbase”. The reason I’ve done it is that having watched it quite recently (and having just freeze-framed my way through it to write these notes), I’m convinced that there’s a lot more to it than is superficially apparent, and that there’s a good piece of fan-fic to be found in there somewhere if anybody feels like tackling it.
As a preamble, it’s worth commenting that the initial scene of Symphony in her cockpit is itself quite an interesting one. She’s had an uneventful flight and is going home. ‘Have completed patrol – am returning to Cloudbase’, she announces over her radio. But what patrol? Do the Angels go gallivanting off over barren deserts on the off-chance that the Mysterons might pull some sort of stunt down below? Surely not – so what was she doing there in the first place? There must have been a reason for her presence – something that is supported by the next event, which is that her aircraft is “hit” by something (which is never identified), causing her to crash. We hear a strange sound immediately prior to Symphony’s aircraft being struck, suggesting that we’re witnessing an attack as opposed to merely a mechanical failure.
After the plane crashes, we see Symphony’s helmet, with its communicator still active, left lying on the ground – something that anybody who was still firing on all thrusters would never do, so we have to believe that Symphony is now in a state of extreme delirium. We see an Angel aircraft overfly her position, but the pilot fails to spot her. It’s not clear at this stage whether this is real or Symphony is hallucinating, but she’s clearly dejected and feeling abandoned. In her delirium, Symphony associates this aircraft with Destiny, who is ordered to return to Cloudbase when the Mysterons issue their threat to destroy it.
In the next scene, we see the inevitable slanging match between Captain Blue and Colonel White when the former realises that the aerial search for Symphony has been called off. During the course of this, White asks Blue whether he is in love with Symphony, and he admits that he is. The meaning of this is obvious – Symphony desperately needs to hear Blue admit his love for her, since he’s evidently never said as much. But women usually know when a man is in love with them, unless the man in question is exceptionally good at concealing his feelings for extended periods of time (e.g. Mr Darcy and Eliza Bennett), and Captain Blue has never come across as someone who can conceal his feelings. On the contrary he’s unusually demonstrative for a man, at least when the issue at stake is someone else’s well-being, so it would be my guess is that he’s not in love with Symphony at all, but reluctant to put her out if her misery by telling her so – assuming that he knows, of course. Men can be incredibly good at completely failing to perceive something that’s blatantly obvious to a woman.
Could he be gay? It’s tempting to consider the possibility, but I don’t think so: Symphony would surely have realised (though my sister once spent several months chasing one particularly unresponsive man before a friend took her to one side and quietly told her that she was wasting her time). No – I think he’s just not interested – which raises the question of why not, since genuinely available men (and a lot who aren’t) don’t tend to turn it down when it’s presented to them on a plate. If there was another woman - especially if that woman was another Angel - Symphony would certainly know about it (or at least have very strong suspicions), either from her own direct observation or from the behaviour of her colleagues. So there’s a mystery here, both to the viewers and almost certainly to Symphony herself, since we are now seeing the world through Symphony’s eyes.
The next element in the puzzle is revealed when a UFO appears on Magenta’s radar screen. Rhapsody is ordered to take off to investigate it, and is blown out of the sky. I think the implication is obvious – in trying to make sense of the situation, Symphony believes she’s identified Rhapsody as a rival for Blue’s affections, and therefore has her eliminated. In passing, I note that the buzzing noise heard in Rhapsody’s cockpit immediately prior to her death is the same one that we hear in Symphony’s cockpit prior to her crash. Could it be that Symphony resents the situation she finds herself in, identifies it with the circumstances of her crash-landing and wishes it upon the woman she now sees as her rival? Maybe. It’s interesting that Symphony uses the Mysterons as the means of killing Rhapsody – it’s almost as if she turns to her enemies in her hour of need, perhaps recognising that only they have the power to destroy the people, real or imagined, that now keep Blue from her. Her own loyalties prevent her from doing this, but by using the enemy she absolves herself from blame.
Why do the Mysterons appear in corporeal form in Symphony’s mind? Their physical presence clearly isn’t necessary for them to carry out their dirty work, and yet Symphony evidently needs them to be there. I wonder if in her delirium she recognises that she is dying, and desperately wants to see her destroyers – just once - before she dies. I’m not convinced by that explanation though.
Colonel White now addresses the troops, after which he tells Scarlet to get his hair cut. Blue asks Scarlet what the colonel wanted to say to him, and Scarlet tells him that the colonel is simply maintaining discipline, and that he’s a wonderful man. Blue takes issue with that sentiment because Symphony has been abandoned. So what’s this bit all about? Symphony is presumably recognising that Scarlet does get out of line sometimes – the incidents related in “White as Snow” are ample evidence of the fact. But is she seeing that facet of his personality as a positive or a negative thing? I think she’s seeing it as a negative thing, because Blue argues with him – and Blue is her man.
So in Symphony’s eyes, Scarlet has done something wrong. And that something is, in her delirious mind, sufficient to warrant sending him to his death – because that's what happens in the next scene, when Scarlet volunteers to attack single-handedly the flying saucers that are now approaching Cloudbase, overriding Colonel White’s initial reaction to send the remaining Angels into action. Symphony has evidently now decided that the remaining Angels are guiltless, and that Scarlet must die for his crime, whatever it might be. Destiny argues in vain with the Colonel on this point, suggesting perhaps that she is an unwilling accomplice to Scarlet’s perceived villainy in some sense.
The Colonel heaps praise upon Scarlet’s bravery, and Lieutenant Green mutters about it being easy to be brave when you’re indestructible – an obvious point that the Colonel plainly can’t see. Presumably Symphony is herself irritated at the amount of praise that Scarlet attracts, and wants to put an end to it – though whether that’s her only motivation for wanting Scarlet out of the way is debatable. Personally, I reckon there’s more to it – I think she’s reacting to what she sees as hypocrisy here, in which Scarlet uses his heroic stature to conceal a darker side.
Before Scarlet can be taken to Sick Bay, Doctor Fawn is killed. In Symphony’s mind, this is presumably to ensure that Scarlet cannot be resuscitated – she has drawn a lethal trap around him from which he cannot escape, again using her enemies to do it so that she cannot personally be blamed. The appearance in Sick Bay of Captain Black is the final nail in Scarlet’s coffin - in this scene, Black is Death, just as surely as if he were wearing a long dark hooded habit and carrying a scythe. Scarlet’s time has come, and he will not be returning ever again.
At this point, Lieutenant Green attempts to calm Colonel White down, just as White attempted to calm him down earlier when he started getting jittery over the Mysterons’ apparent inaction. I think Symphony is saying here that she sees Green as every bit the Colonel’s equal, and that the Colonel is belatedly recognising the fact. Captain Magenta by now has gone completely potty trying to count the flying saucers – something that comes over as a bit of a comic interlude. Perhaps Symphony’s simply expressing the view that in her eyes he’s simply a waste of space, but again I’m not entirely happy with that: the fact that Magenta appears in the story at all suggests to me that he’s in some way involved in whatever intrigue Symphony is trying to unravel in her mind.
By this time Cloudbase is on the point of crashing. Captain Blue gives a detailed and presumably accurate assessment of the situation to Colonel White, who evidently finally recognises Blue’s true worth – Symphony clearly feels that he has been undervalued in the past. Blue’s arm is broken in the attack, and Colonel White’s permission for him to take a jet pack and escape comes too late for him to take advantage of it. This is interesting – does Symphony want him to escape or not? Obviously she invents the broken arm to prevent him from doing so, and yet his words imply that had his arm not been broken, he would have tried to escape. Perhaps she wants to know how he feels when faced with certain death – will he be the noble man that she believes him to be right to the end?
By now the end is very near. The Colonel’s last message to Spectrum Headquarters in London includes the words that “Cloudbase is severely damaged and out of control”. I’m wondering if maybe there’s a double meaning here. Is Symphony perhaps saying that the moral fibre of the personnel on Cloudbase is severely damaged and out of control? Cloudbase then begins to fall out of the sky, with the Colonel going down with his command. It is not clear whether Captain Blue dies before the base is destroyed.
There are an awful lot of questions here, and I’m hoping that some of them will get tackled in any discussion that gets added to this thread. What sort of dark plots are being hatched in the recesses of Symphony’s delirium? And are they entirely the product of her deranged imagination – or is there more substance there than might appear on the surface?
DocBrown
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DocBrown
by Marion W » Sat Jul 03, 2004 3:34 am
Wow Doc, here is a discussion and a half. I don’t have the CS episodes to hand, so I am going on memory here. I also reserve the woman’s right to change her mind at a later date – and may even deny that I ever said any of this at all… but here goes.
Firstly, I have to say that I have always considered ‘Attack on Cloudbase’ as one of my favourite episodes – largely because it didn’t really have the usual (tedious) Mysteron threat in it – but did show rather more of the personalities of the characters than we usually got to see -always accepting that they might well be slightly exaggerated by Symphony’s delirium (a fact she admits at the very end – when she embarrasses everyone at her ‘de-briefing’)
The fact that there was the little romance bubbling under the overall shenanigans did it no harm either.
I think the key question is – where does ‘reality’ leave off and Symphony’s delirium take over?
It might seem odd that Symphony is out on patrol – but it isn’t the only time Angels are mentioned as doing that. Rhapsody comes back from a similarly fruitless fly around in ‘Spectrum Strikes Back’
What happened to Symphony’s plane is a mystery – perhaps we are meant to deduce that it was due to similar faults to those that affected the hovercrafts at Koala Base in ‘Traitor’ – it definitely happens before the Mysterons threaten Cloudbase anyway.
We can assume she was hurt in the crash because she does go wandering off, which is a very silly thing to do. But we can also assume that once she had crashed Cloudbase would launch a search, so Destiny’s flight over the area is real. Her failure to find Symphony might be because, although she finds the plane and sees the footprints walking away, she cannot see an individual. The Angels wear pale uniforms, unlikely to be highly visible against a background of sand dunes and, even flying slowly, I suspect an Angel interceptor is not the best vehicle to use for searching a desert for one person. Symphony might well feel deserted by her friends as she sees Destiny fly away – she certainly looks miserable enough. (One of the finest shots in the whole series - if you ask me).
Now we come on to the question of Captain Blue and his relationship with Symphony. (I have to declare an interest here – as anyone who has read any of my fiction will know – I think it is a real relationship, although not always an easy one.
I tend to think he might well have gone storming off to see the Colonel on hearing that Destiny had returned without Symphony. He was already stroppy enough for Scarlet to have to reassure him that Destiny would find her. I agree with you, that he seems to get worked up over other people’s safety – usually Captain Scarlet’s – but of course, there is the other episode that suggests a relationship with Symphony –‘Manhunt’.
I like to think he did – finally – admit to the Colonel that he cared for her – not that it came as much of a surprise to Colonel White – or anyone else, I suspect. Although – it is possible that he might have been a little surprised himself! (Yes, I suppose I am... yes, I am!)
I have my own pet theory – and I am wandering into fanfic here – that Magenta has a soft spot for her too – based largely (I admit) on the fact that she’s hanging onto his chair at the party with the Mysteronised champagne and the biographical data that they both went to Yale… (I didn’t say it made sense). If this is the case, his ineffectualness during the Mysteron attack might be connected to her perception of him as coming a poor second to Captain Blue…? (Symphony: ‘Captain Magenta, you were so eager to please.’ Magenta: ‘Well, I try…’)
What happens after Blue’s conversation with Colonel White – the Mysteron attack - Magenta’s inability to count – Green’s sniping at Scarlet – Rhapsody’s death – is all the product of Symphony’s fevered imagination. (Although I accept that her belief that her boyfriend is undervalued might well account for the cynicism shown towards Scarlet!)
I also wonder about Blue’s broken arm… it is hardly likely to impede him from making an attempt to leave the crashing Cloudbase – unless he chose to let it. I think she was just imagining how she knew he would react – as she tells him later – ‘You were just –Adam’ – as if that is enough to tell him (and everyone else) what she means.
Anyway – it is a good episode – clearly open to several interpretations so I don’t think there is a right answer to this!
Marion W
Firstly, I have to say that I have always considered ‘Attack on Cloudbase’ as one of my favourite episodes – largely because it didn’t really have the usual (tedious) Mysteron threat in it – but did show rather more of the personalities of the characters than we usually got to see -always accepting that they might well be slightly exaggerated by Symphony’s delirium (a fact she admits at the very end – when she embarrasses everyone at her ‘de-briefing’)
The fact that there was the little romance bubbling under the overall shenanigans did it no harm either.
I think the key question is – where does ‘reality’ leave off and Symphony’s delirium take over?
It might seem odd that Symphony is out on patrol – but it isn’t the only time Angels are mentioned as doing that. Rhapsody comes back from a similarly fruitless fly around in ‘Spectrum Strikes Back’
What happened to Symphony’s plane is a mystery – perhaps we are meant to deduce that it was due to similar faults to those that affected the hovercrafts at Koala Base in ‘Traitor’ – it definitely happens before the Mysterons threaten Cloudbase anyway.
We can assume she was hurt in the crash because she does go wandering off, which is a very silly thing to do. But we can also assume that once she had crashed Cloudbase would launch a search, so Destiny’s flight over the area is real. Her failure to find Symphony might be because, although she finds the plane and sees the footprints walking away, she cannot see an individual. The Angels wear pale uniforms, unlikely to be highly visible against a background of sand dunes and, even flying slowly, I suspect an Angel interceptor is not the best vehicle to use for searching a desert for one person. Symphony might well feel deserted by her friends as she sees Destiny fly away – she certainly looks miserable enough. (One of the finest shots in the whole series - if you ask me).
Now we come on to the question of Captain Blue and his relationship with Symphony. (I have to declare an interest here – as anyone who has read any of my fiction will know – I think it is a real relationship, although not always an easy one.
I tend to think he might well have gone storming off to see the Colonel on hearing that Destiny had returned without Symphony. He was already stroppy enough for Scarlet to have to reassure him that Destiny would find her. I agree with you, that he seems to get worked up over other people’s safety – usually Captain Scarlet’s – but of course, there is the other episode that suggests a relationship with Symphony –‘Manhunt’.
- - Blue and Symphony are sitting close together on the sofa as the Colonel explains Captain Black has been seen, a fact emphasised by Scarlet’s sitting away from them in a chair
- Blue admits to buying her a medallion for her birthday.
- He sulks when he realises she’s missing and is ready to rush into the atomic station to search for her – despite orders to wait.
- He’s quick enough to answer for her when the Colonel is debriefing them too.
I like to think he did – finally – admit to the Colonel that he cared for her – not that it came as much of a surprise to Colonel White – or anyone else, I suspect. Although – it is possible that he might have been a little surprised himself! (Yes, I suppose I am... yes, I am!)
I have my own pet theory – and I am wandering into fanfic here – that Magenta has a soft spot for her too – based largely (I admit) on the fact that she’s hanging onto his chair at the party with the Mysteronised champagne and the biographical data that they both went to Yale… (I didn’t say it made sense). If this is the case, his ineffectualness during the Mysteron attack might be connected to her perception of him as coming a poor second to Captain Blue…? (Symphony: ‘Captain Magenta, you were so eager to please.’ Magenta: ‘Well, I try…’)
What happens after Blue’s conversation with Colonel White – the Mysteron attack - Magenta’s inability to count – Green’s sniping at Scarlet – Rhapsody’s death – is all the product of Symphony’s fevered imagination. (Although I accept that her belief that her boyfriend is undervalued might well account for the cynicism shown towards Scarlet!)
I also wonder about Blue’s broken arm… it is hardly likely to impede him from making an attempt to leave the crashing Cloudbase – unless he chose to let it. I think she was just imagining how she knew he would react – as she tells him later – ‘You were just –Adam’ – as if that is enough to tell him (and everyone else) what she means.
Anyway – it is a good episode – clearly open to several interpretations so I don’t think there is a right answer to this!
Marion W
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Marion W
by Captain Ruddy » Sat Jul 03, 2004 3:37 am
Not one of my favorite episodes, so I'll leave the commentary to the others, except to point out one line of dialogue that always makes me roll my eyes. When White orders Destiny to report to the Control Room as Scarlet will take her patrol, and Destiny protests, White says "Get DOWN here! That's an order!"
uhh... "down"?!
psst... Colonel, the Control Room is *above* the rest of Cloudbase...
Cheers!
CAPTAIN RUDDY
uhh... "down"?!
psst... Colonel, the Control Room is *above* the rest of Cloudbase...
Cheers!
CAPTAIN RUDDY
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Captain Ruddy
by Marion W » Sat Jul 03, 2004 3:38 am
The poor old soul - the tension must've been getting to him! Still, it isn't like the colonel not to know which way is up... 
Marion W
Marion W
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Marion W
by DocDenim » Sat Jul 03, 2004 3:39 am
Hmmmm.
I'm wondering if perhaps the Colonel was thinking:
"Get DOWN out of that cockpit immediately, woman!" since Destiny would have had to come down out of the Interceptor before she could possibly go up anywhere else.
Maybe....
Doc Denim
I'm wondering if perhaps the Colonel was thinking:
"Get DOWN out of that cockpit immediately, woman!" since Destiny would have had to come down out of the Interceptor before she could possibly go up anywhere else.
Maybe....
Doc Denim
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DocDenim
by Carrie Captain Azure » Sat Jul 03, 2004 3:41 am
Phew..Doc..this is practically a thesis. Personally I think that Tony Barwick had maybe a teensy weensy bit too much of the ginseng tea when penning this one...But anyway I thought such a fine précis deserved a reply, even if its just to ask more questions.. I rushed off to watch it again, spurred on by your jottings.
I assume that the entire episode (apart from the scenes when she a) crashes b) sees an interceptor flying over (possibly not...) and c) gets rescued is completely the product of her nightmare. I had to reassure myself of that again as it wasn't clear to me before I watched it again to answer your note.
Its interesting that she imagines the Colonel to have little regard for her life...several times this is spelled out...what's the significance of this in her mind? Could she be seeing him as a father figure? Had she been rejected by her own father in her youth?
I agree with Marion that there is something going on with Blue and Symphony..for me the events in Manhunt strongly suggest it. Of course, Blue could be giving all the Angels jewellery for their birthdays for all we know...maybe he's just that sort of a nice guy...
When Blue admits he loves her to the Colonel, it could simply be her way of trying to come to terms with how they would bring their relationship out in the open.
Mind you it might well be out in the open anyway,since her cryptic comment at the end "You were just..Adam" is responded to by Scarlet as if he knew what that comment meant. "Sounds like it wasn't so bad after all.." And the way Blue asks her.."How was I?" sounded like a man who wanted to be portrayed in the best positive light by a woman he feels something for. Of course, he could just be a rampant egotist and miffed that she hadn't mentioned him up to that point....
The scene with Magenta is puzzling...cant figure that one out at all.unless she's scared of him and this is her way of dealing with it..There's been a couple of references to Magenta's eagerness...it doesn't compute with me...this guys supposed to have been a ruthless criminal mastermind..for goodness sake...he's portrayed in the series as a ditzy puppy dog...unless this is a cover of course....and sorry..that's off the subject..but I thought I'd let off steam about it anyway...
Carrie Captain Azure
I assume that the entire episode (apart from the scenes when she a) crashes b) sees an interceptor flying over (possibly not...) and c) gets rescued is completely the product of her nightmare. I had to reassure myself of that again as it wasn't clear to me before I watched it again to answer your note.
Its interesting that she imagines the Colonel to have little regard for her life...several times this is spelled out...what's the significance of this in her mind? Could she be seeing him as a father figure? Had she been rejected by her own father in her youth?
I agree with Marion that there is something going on with Blue and Symphony..for me the events in Manhunt strongly suggest it. Of course, Blue could be giving all the Angels jewellery for their birthdays for all we know...maybe he's just that sort of a nice guy...
When Blue admits he loves her to the Colonel, it could simply be her way of trying to come to terms with how they would bring their relationship out in the open.
Mind you it might well be out in the open anyway,since her cryptic comment at the end "You were just..Adam" is responded to by Scarlet as if he knew what that comment meant. "Sounds like it wasn't so bad after all.." And the way Blue asks her.."How was I?" sounded like a man who wanted to be portrayed in the best positive light by a woman he feels something for. Of course, he could just be a rampant egotist and miffed that she hadn't mentioned him up to that point....
The scene with Magenta is puzzling...cant figure that one out at all.unless she's scared of him and this is her way of dealing with it..There's been a couple of references to Magenta's eagerness...it doesn't compute with me...this guys supposed to have been a ruthless criminal mastermind..for goodness sake...he's portrayed in the series as a ditzy puppy dog...unless this is a cover of course....and sorry..that's off the subject..but I thought I'd let off steam about it anyway...
Carrie Captain Azure
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Carrie Captain Azure
by DocBrown » Sat Jul 03, 2004 3:42 am
You know, I do believe that comment about the Colonel hits the nail right on the head. If there’s one word that I feel comes out of the whole story, it would have to be “Betrayal”. She’s been abandoned; she’s trying to make sense of the reason she’s been abandoned, and she’s planning her revenge upon those who have treated her so cruelly. The slow drift from despair into anger is symbolized by the sky, which progressively darkens as the sequence of events unfolds in her mind.
Perhaps she’s asking whether Captain Blue, whom she desperately wants to believe is still her one true friend, is part of the plot or not - something to which she never finds the answer, since his fate is unknown as Cloudbase begins to fall out of the sky. Interesting though that the Colonel is the only other person who survives right to the end, since as you said, his apparent indifference to her fate is clear from the start – even though his reasoning is perfectly sound.
And you’re right - what is the thing about Magenta? I’ve never been able to reconcile his official biography with the character we see on the screen, and I suppose the discrepancy is largely due to the character never really having been properly developed during the series. Magenta tries – but never quite gets there. Perhaps that’s the message we’re supposed to take home from this – but I still don’t feel it’s clear at all.
DocBrown
Perhaps she’s asking whether Captain Blue, whom she desperately wants to believe is still her one true friend, is part of the plot or not - something to which she never finds the answer, since his fate is unknown as Cloudbase begins to fall out of the sky. Interesting though that the Colonel is the only other person who survives right to the end, since as you said, his apparent indifference to her fate is clear from the start – even though his reasoning is perfectly sound.
And you’re right - what is the thing about Magenta? I’ve never been able to reconcile his official biography with the character we see on the screen, and I suppose the discrepancy is largely due to the character never really having been properly developed during the series. Magenta tries – but never quite gets there. Perhaps that’s the message we’re supposed to take home from this – but I still don’t feel it’s clear at all.
DocBrown
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DocBrown
by Marion » Sun Aug 01, 2004 10:13 am
The only other occaision I can think of, when Magenta's enthusiasm is mentioned, is in 'Operation Time' when he discovers the news about General Tiempo's operation in the newspaper and that might just be relief at discovering the Mysterons' target.
It is hard with all the Captains - except Scarlet and Blue, and even they are pretty sketchy - to get a real idea of what they are like. They are all top men in their professions and they must be good to be on Cloudbase. I don't think a 'ditzy puppy dog' (love that description, Carrie) would last five minutes.
It has always puzzled me why - when they portray Destiny as the 'Angel Leader' (she even gets her own slot in the credits) she is not used that often in the series. Okay she gets shot at by Mysteronised jets... but spends most of the time hiding in a ditch, with Captain Scarlet's arm around her. (And, if the Mysterons hadn't gone for her in that episode, I think the style police would have... just remember her awful trouser-suit too
The woman is a fashion nightmare!)
Symphony, on the other hand, gets kidnapped in Manhunt, has most speaking lines in Model Spy, shoots the TVR7 music satellite down, and has her own adventure in 'Attack on Cloudbase'. She's also the only Angel for whom any kind of personal relationship with anyone is hinted at.... except that Destiny identifies Scarlet's original body (and why Destiny? - I guess that might suggest she knew him well.)
The balance is different in the comics (as far as I can remember) and some biographical details suggest Melody is the 'unofficial leader' of the Angel flight!
It gets worse!
If I had a time machine, I would love to go back to the planning meetings for Captain Scarlet and get them to DO IT PROPERLY!!!
Mind you, it would spoil our fun trying to make sense of it all
It is hard with all the Captains - except Scarlet and Blue, and even they are pretty sketchy - to get a real idea of what they are like. They are all top men in their professions and they must be good to be on Cloudbase. I don't think a 'ditzy puppy dog' (love that description, Carrie) would last five minutes.
It has always puzzled me why - when they portray Destiny as the 'Angel Leader' (she even gets her own slot in the credits) she is not used that often in the series. Okay she gets shot at by Mysteronised jets... but spends most of the time hiding in a ditch, with Captain Scarlet's arm around her. (And, if the Mysterons hadn't gone for her in that episode, I think the style police would have... just remember her awful trouser-suit too
The woman is a fashion nightmare!)Symphony, on the other hand, gets kidnapped in Manhunt, has most speaking lines in Model Spy, shoots the TVR7 music satellite down, and has her own adventure in 'Attack on Cloudbase'. She's also the only Angel for whom any kind of personal relationship with anyone is hinted at.... except that Destiny identifies Scarlet's original body (and why Destiny? - I guess that might suggest she knew him well.)
The balance is different in the comics (as far as I can remember) and some biographical details suggest Melody is the 'unofficial leader' of the Angel flight!
It gets worse!
If I had a time machine, I would love to go back to the planning meetings for Captain Scarlet and get them to DO IT PROPERLY!!!
Mind you, it would spoil our fun trying to make sense of it all
A disinclination to sparkle...
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Marion
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by Devon » Fri Aug 06, 2004 7:38 am
Um Doc?
I hate to point this out but the Command section is still higher up than the flight deck so 'down' still wouldn't be an apt expression.
I hate to point this out but the Command section is still higher up than the flight deck so 'down' still wouldn't be an apt expression.
No one ever said this kind of job was going to be easy. If they had said impossible, I could have handled that.
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by Carrie » Fri Aug 06, 2004 10:26 pm
Ah..Destiny..yes..for a Frenchwoman her fashion sense left a little to be desired...although Symphony's blue kipper tie in Model Spy came a VERY close second for the yeuchh factor. Maybe she was hiding her microphone behind it...
Your point about Symphony Marion, I wonder if that was an ploy to make it more interesting to a North American audience?
Could it be possible that the credits were created before the main episodes and they just decided afterwards that they preferred or needed more Symphony?
Your point about Symphony Marion, I wonder if that was an ploy to make it more interesting to a North American audience?
Could it be possible that the credits were created before the main episodes and they just decided afterwards that they preferred or needed more Symphony?
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Carrie
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by Marion » Sat Aug 07, 2004 7:54 am
Yeah, I guess it is something as prosaic as you suggest, Carrie. I suppose that's why Scarlet's side-kick is an American too, come to think of it.
At least they made an nod towards acknowledging there are more than two nationalities on the planet.
None of the Angels show that much dress sense, do they? But, I'd have chosen the blue trouser-suit - even with the kipper tie - over the thing Destiny wears, which looks like it was made from left over horse blankets Maybe we shouldn't quibble though - the fashion industry has come up with some howlers in the past - perhaps by the 2060s we'll all be desperate to wear something equally alarming...
Another point occurs to me - given that the 1960's fashion was dominated by the mini-skirt - it did rather hamper them, that they couldn't show the puppets' legs
Even Lady P wore her skirts below her knees!
At least they made an nod towards acknowledging there are more than two nationalities on the planet.
None of the Angels show that much dress sense, do they? But, I'd have chosen the blue trouser-suit - even with the kipper tie - over the thing Destiny wears, which looks like it was made from left over horse blankets
Maybe we shouldn't quibble though - the fashion industry has come up with some howlers in the past - perhaps by the 2060s we'll all be desperate to wear something equally alarming... Another point occurs to me - given that the 1960's fashion was dominated by the mini-skirt - it did rather hamper them, that they couldn't show the puppets' legs
Even Lady P wore her skirts below her knees!A disinclination to sparkle...
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Marion
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by Clya Brown » Wed Nov 17, 2004 10:33 pm
Interesting - I've never thought of that before. Presumably mini-skirts would have revealed that the female puppets had rather less realistic legs than the more conventionally visible parts of their anatomies! But in hindsight it's probably just as well that they didn't manage to solve that problem, since the mini-skirt didn't survive past the early 1970s - and the series might have looked distinctly dated by the end of that decade!
As it is, the only real date giveaways are minor details like analogue clocks - and even those can be explained away without too much difficulty. I'm sure I read somewhere that analogue clocks are preferred even now in situations when the user has to anticipate time intervals before performing some action like launching a missile, because it's easier to judge.
The only other ones I can think of offhand are the occasional reference to London Airport (but then perhaps Gatwick was converted into a spaceport during the early days of exploration of the Solar System from c. 2045 onwards) and the remarkable similarity between the switches on some of the more high-tech instrument panels and the temperature controls on Baby Belling cookers. No doubt Belling successfully bid to become the preferred supplier of state-of-the-art technology to assorted security organisations within the World Government after the Atomic War of 2028...
As it is, the only real date giveaways are minor details like analogue clocks - and even those can be explained away without too much difficulty. I'm sure I read somewhere that analogue clocks are preferred even now in situations when the user has to anticipate time intervals before performing some action like launching a missile, because it's easier to judge.
The only other ones I can think of offhand are the occasional reference to London Airport (but then perhaps Gatwick was converted into a spaceport during the early days of exploration of the Solar System from c. 2045 onwards) and the remarkable similarity between the switches on some of the more high-tech instrument panels and the temperature controls on Baby Belling cookers. No doubt Belling successfully bid to become the preferred supplier of state-of-the-art technology to assorted security organisations within the World Government after the Atomic War of 2028...
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Clya Brown
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by Marion » Thu Nov 18, 2004 1:24 pm
There is a lot to be said for the approach to labelling taken in the 2060's though. After all, it's jolly handy that every time they are somewhere new and unknown - every switch is clearly labelled - even if they do look like cooker switches - so that they have no trouble finding the master switch to stop the place exploding or whatever the disaster is this week.
I think Expo 68 is the only one where anyone (in that case CS) has to unwire something - but then that is a nuclear reactor and that's bound to be more complicated..... (You pull out these wires and it'll be alright - don't worry about the radiation... we have it all under control. )
Mind you - they are definitely lacking in typing skills - it took two of them far too long to type in possible keywords when they were at Base Concord.... and even then the words had to be spelt out with excruciating slowness.... a ... m ... e ... n ... amen..... (Yes, thank you Captain Blue, you may move into the next round of the spelling competition...
I think Expo 68 is the only one where anyone (in that case CS) has to unwire something - but then that is a nuclear reactor and that's bound to be more complicated..... (You pull out these wires and it'll be alright - don't worry about the radiation... we have it all under control.
)Mind you - they are definitely lacking in typing skills - it took two of them far too long to type in possible keywords when they were at Base Concord.... and even then the words had to be spelt out with excruciating slowness.... a ... m ... e ... n ... amen..... (Yes, thank you Captain Blue, you may move into the next round of the spelling competition...
A disinclination to sparkle...
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Marion
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by Captain Indigo » Thu Nov 18, 2004 11:53 pm
That was quite frightning, realising that those two guys are in charge of saving the world every week, with spelling like that! 
'The road to hell is paved with frozen door-to-door salesmen. On weekends, many of the younger demons go ice-skating on them.'
Caption Game results.
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Captain Indigo
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by Mary » Fri Nov 19, 2004 2:01 am
On this side of the Pond, the dead giveaway to me was the vehicles obviously kit-bashed from models of boxy 1960s cars. However my friends "over there" were quick to point out that their cars didn't look like that and therefore WERE unusual to them...
Cheers!
Mary
(Captain Ruddy)
Cheers!
Mary
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